Yesterday at Two Rivers Church we tackled a very difficult topic in our series "Confessions of a sinful church." Our apology was this, "We are sorry for our mistreatment of homosexuals." As you can imagine this was a very sensitive subject and our interactive text message element reflected this.
Before I list every comment, let me give you a couple statistics:
According to Gallup's 2008 Values and Beliefs survey
48% of Americans believe that homosexual relations are morally wrong &
48% of Americans believe that homosexual relations are morally acceptable
In 2001:
53% believed it morally wrong (that's a 5 point drop)
40% believed it morally acceptable (that's an 8 point increase)
According to Lifeway research:
39% of Catholics
61% of Protestants
79% of evangelical Protestants said they do believe homosexual behavior is sinful.
29% of Americans said their decision to visit or join a church would be positively affected if that congregation taught homosexual behavior is a sin.
32% of Americans – almost one in three – said their decision to visit or join a church would be negatively affected if that congregation taught homosexual behavior is sinful.
TRC Interactive:
thumbs up....wow
so isnt the issue sexual immorality and lust rather than the persons preference
even with your view that homosexuality is a sin, how would you welcome a person(s) to your church?
How does the view of homosexuality apply to people who undergo surgery/treatment to change how the world precives them?
we are still called to love
love the sinner not the sin
how do you draw a line between loving a homosexual and being seen as hypocritical?
So just because a couple can't reproduce means its wrong?
how do we help other christians (that represent option one) understand the need for relationship evangalism?
it is not our place to judge. God still loves the sinner..(us!) so why should we not love others?!
reproduction has nothing do do with it. lust and sexual immorality as sin is the issue
Should we hate them and terrorize them, NO. But are we supposed to except what the bible clearly say is wrong?
...and if were really growing in Him we LOVE like Him...God sent His Son to die for all sinners because He loved us...love is the answer.
We should not accept and do nothing. We are to accept the person, and in a loving manner..lead them to the truth
Unsuccessful apology = calling homosexuality a struggle, like its a disease that you can be cured
as we grow in Christ, we must grow closer to Him and become more like Him and in order to do that we must learn to love like He loved and loves
homosexuality is a strugglejust as one would struggle with any other sinful temptation
still.. How do we argue against legalization of same sex marriage without looking like we don't accept homosexuals
In order to minister to someone, you must love them enough to want to show them God's love -3 Little Birds
Great comments / questions. Later this week I will tackle some of these.
Monday, September 28, 2009
Thursday, September 24, 2009
interactive questions
So, we had a lot of responses to our interactive element this past Sunday (see previous post) and out of this plethora of feedback there were actually a couple of really good questions. Each week we use this element I will follow-up here on my blog with answers to the questions which did not get answered on Sunday morning.
1. Was Back to the Future based on a novel?
According to Wikipedia, Back to the Future was a 1985 science fiction adventure film directed by Robert Zemeckis, co-written by Bob Gale and produced by Steven Spielberg. Zemeckis and Gale wrote the script after Gale mused upon whether he would have befriended his father if they attended school together.
So the answer to the question is no, Back to the Future was written as a screenplay not a novel.
2. To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
This is almost a question so I will answer this as well. To Kill a Mockingbird is a Pulitzer Prize-winning novel by Harper Lee published in 1960. It was instantly successful and has become a classic of modern American literature. (again from Wikipedia)
3. Does goat milk spoil faster than cow milk? ((VNS&DNE)<3)
I'm not sure what this has to do with anything and there is not much information about the subject. What I did find out is that raw goat or cow milk does spoil faster than pasteurized.
4. Wouldn't it be funny if someone jumped out of the booth??
No, actually what would be funny is if someone repelled down on top of the Confession Booth.
5. Are Christians to think of themselves as slaves to Christ?
The idea of being a slave to Christ is mentioned one time in the New Testament in the book of Ephesians chapter 6:
5Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but like slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not men
The context of this passage is to teach those who were slaves (most likely indentured servants) to be true to their position and honor the relationship they have with their master. Paul makes the analogy that they should serve their masters just as they would serve Christ. In the 1st century church there were many who were slaves and had become Christians, so this analogy would be familiar to their culture. For us today the analogy still rings true, we should submit to Christ as a slave would submit to their master.
Another of the interactive texts stated that we are not slaves, rather sons of the King. This is also a New Testament principle. Galatians 3 states:
26You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
We are all heirs to the promise of Abraham, children of the King. There is no distinction when it pertains to the availability of salvation to all.
6. Why was slavery permitted in Jesus time?
Slavery is something that has been around in different forms for as long as history has been recorded. The fist mention of slavery in the Bible is in the book of Genesis as Abram is introduced. Most scholars believe that many of the slaves in Jesus' day and culture were more like indentured servants than what we think of as slaves. Those who were in debt could work for the one who they were indebted to as a means of working off their debt. Jewish law states in that Hebrew slaves must be set free after six years. While we are certainly appalled by the idea of slavery we cannot change history or past cultures, we can only hope to work for those who are still in slavery in parts of the world today.
7. Is flying the confederate flag offensive to others?
I would say, and this is strictly my opinion, that there are some who are offended by the confederate flag and there are some who are not. Just like there are some who fly the confederate flag with only southern pride and no racist intent and there are those who fly the stars and bars because they want to make a racial statement. I believe that as Christians we should be careful how we celebrate our heritage whether it is southern, African, or otherwise, we should always do our best to represent Christ first. That means that there may be times when we don't do something that might be offensive even if it is not meant with that intent.
Overall, I really like the fact that we can have dialog about the teaching, so we will continue to use the interactive element with some tweaks. May we all strive to learn and grow as a community of believers.
1. Was Back to the Future based on a novel?
According to Wikipedia, Back to the Future was a 1985 science fiction adventure film directed by Robert Zemeckis, co-written by Bob Gale and produced by Steven Spielberg. Zemeckis and Gale wrote the script after Gale mused upon whether he would have befriended his father if they attended school together.
So the answer to the question is no, Back to the Future was written as a screenplay not a novel.
2. To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
This is almost a question so I will answer this as well. To Kill a Mockingbird is a Pulitzer Prize-winning novel by Harper Lee published in 1960. It was instantly successful and has become a classic of modern American literature. (again from Wikipedia)
3. Does goat milk spoil faster than cow milk? ((VNS&DNE)<3)
I'm not sure what this has to do with anything and there is not much information about the subject. What I did find out is that raw goat or cow milk does spoil faster than pasteurized.
4. Wouldn't it be funny if someone jumped out of the booth??
No, actually what would be funny is if someone repelled down on top of the Confession Booth.
5. Are Christians to think of themselves as slaves to Christ?
The idea of being a slave to Christ is mentioned one time in the New Testament in the book of Ephesians chapter 6:
5Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but like slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not men
The context of this passage is to teach those who were slaves (most likely indentured servants) to be true to their position and honor the relationship they have with their master. Paul makes the analogy that they should serve their masters just as they would serve Christ. In the 1st century church there were many who were slaves and had become Christians, so this analogy would be familiar to their culture. For us today the analogy still rings true, we should submit to Christ as a slave would submit to their master.
Another of the interactive texts stated that we are not slaves, rather sons of the King. This is also a New Testament principle. Galatians 3 states:
26You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
We are all heirs to the promise of Abraham, children of the King. There is no distinction when it pertains to the availability of salvation to all.
6. Why was slavery permitted in Jesus time?
Slavery is something that has been around in different forms for as long as history has been recorded. The fist mention of slavery in the Bible is in the book of Genesis as Abram is introduced. Most scholars believe that many of the slaves in Jesus' day and culture were more like indentured servants than what we think of as slaves. Those who were in debt could work for the one who they were indebted to as a means of working off their debt. Jewish law states in that Hebrew slaves must be set free after six years. While we are certainly appalled by the idea of slavery we cannot change history or past cultures, we can only hope to work for those who are still in slavery in parts of the world today.
7. Is flying the confederate flag offensive to others?
I would say, and this is strictly my opinion, that there are some who are offended by the confederate flag and there are some who are not. Just like there are some who fly the confederate flag with only southern pride and no racist intent and there are those who fly the stars and bars because they want to make a racial statement. I believe that as Christians we should be careful how we celebrate our heritage whether it is southern, African, or otherwise, we should always do our best to represent Christ first. That means that there may be times when we don't do something that might be offensive even if it is not meant with that intent.
Overall, I really like the fact that we can have dialog about the teaching, so we will continue to use the interactive element with some tweaks. May we all strive to learn and grow as a community of believers.
new worship element
This past Sunday at TRC we ushered in a new element to our adult teaching time. After much effort we figured out how to have interactive text messaging. Essentially our attenders could text questions or comments about the teaching and they were displayed on the screen. Most of our folks liked the concept, but we all agreed that there needed to be a few tweaks to make it more effective.
Below is the thread of all the comments we received starting from bottom to top: (Note- there were two directed questions that I asked which is explains some of the responses, 1. What's your favorite American novel? 2. What's the worst kind of insect sting?)
giant radio active pamlico county mosquitos
A lady bug bite...ugh
Caterpillar...trust me it can happen
My ex husband
Ticks
Eddy put c's answer on the board. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Twinrivers man spidermonkeys are bad one bit my leg off.
Lol ((VNS&DNE)<3)
A wasp on your eyelid lol.
An ant bite to the toe...the day before my wedding!
Since people are putting spiders which are not insects, im going to say a snake bite
Mosquito's
Spiderman
Bullet ants..I have never been stung but this guy was on tv
$corpians
horsefly
We are not slaves of christ but sons of the king
The poisonness kind. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Horse fly
Horse fly
Horsefly
Cow killer ants
A wasp sting on your behind.
fire ants...they sting and itch and swell. jerks
Scorpion... Trust me it was really bad. Like hospital bad!!!
Red hornet
Wasp/hornet
An ant bite to the toe...the day before my wedding!
A lady bug bite...ugh
Fireant
Horsefly
Hornet
Caterpillar
Ground Bee
Fire ants
Brown recluse spider
Hornet
Red ants
That wasn't intresting that was boring
Sorry mean 1710
Mennonites were some of the first settlers of new bern in 17101 interesting!
Because people were too indolent to do things themselves. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Yours is working i see it
Why was slavery permitted in jesus time
Are Christians to think of themselves as slaves to Christ?
How do i know if mine is or isn't doing this?
Why is mine not up there
Yes it would be
Wouldn't it be funny if someone jumped out of the booth??
A walk 2 remember
Not working still.
Does goat milk spoil faster than cow milk? ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Roots
Reedeming love by francine rivers
To Kill A Mockingbird
The Shack by William Young
Nicolas sparks is a good author. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Star Wars!
The Lion, Witch , & the Wardrobe ΓΌ Chronicles of Narnia
LOTR is not an American work
all harry potter books
My sisters keeper
really? lol
The Outsiders
The stand
Turn Up The Heat
I love that movie.
Message in a bottle
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
Lord of the Rings
The sisterhood of the traveling pants
The cat in the hat
Breaking Dawn :Stephanie Meyer
lords of Dicsipline
The hardy boys
Nicolas sparks is a good author. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
The Notebook
Marry poppins
Old Man and the Sea
Frankenstein
My favorite author is Frank Perretti
My favorite book is The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks. £@UR¤N
Reedeming love by francine rivers
TWILIGHT! By: Stephanie Meyer
tom sawyer
The Pact by Jodi Picoult
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
A walk 2 remember
The stand
The Godfather
Where the red fern grows
was Back to the Future based on a novel?
Frank Perretti
Twilight. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Of mice and men
Just trying it out
This is super cool :) ((VNS&DNE)<3)
can you hear me now...
I don't read
how do i know if mine is working or not?
Of all sermons to be serious this is THE one. Stop the text joking.
bullants
Is The confederate flad offensive? £@UR¤N
All ants.
a wasp sting on your booty.
Is flying the confederate flag offensive to others? £@UR¤N
A 20 ft tall yellow jacket
a wasp sting on your booty.
ants
jellyfish sting.
fire ants!
I HATE it when bed bugs bite!!!
spidermokey
Chores are slavery! £@UR¤N
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know If this is American? Ha!
this is pretty cool. hey everyone!
this is pretty cool. hey everyone!
Does prostitution count as slavery? £@UR¤N
mine isnt working
Riding Lessons £@UR¤N
why is william sanders so old?
The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks £@UR¤N
harry potter
The Scarlet letter £@UR¤N
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know If this is American. Ha!
Wait yes it did
plus your comments
Why is this not working?
harry potter books
My phones not doing this.
of mice and men is my favorite book i haven't read it though
i don't understand how to do this
my favorite book is of mice and men i haven't read it though
Marley and Me
The Pact by Jodi Picoult....anything by her is great!
i think jrr tolkien was british. i thought he said american writers.
to kill a mocking bird- I don't know I'd this is American. Ha!
Of mice and men is my favorite book i haven't read it though
The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks £@UR¤N
a child called it. £@UR¤N
I don't read
i don't read
Gone with the wind
the appeal
HARRY POTTER!!!
White Fang
Below is the thread of all the comments we received starting from bottom to top: (Note- there were two directed questions that I asked which is explains some of the responses, 1. What's your favorite American novel? 2. What's the worst kind of insect sting?)
giant radio active pamlico county mosquitos
A lady bug bite...ugh
Caterpillar...trust me it can happen
My ex husband
Ticks
Eddy put c's answer on the board. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Twinrivers man spidermonkeys are bad one bit my leg off.
Lol ((VNS&DNE)<3)
A wasp on your eyelid lol.
An ant bite to the toe...the day before my wedding!
Since people are putting spiders which are not insects, im going to say a snake bite
Mosquito's
Spiderman
Bullet ants..I have never been stung but this guy was on tv
$corpians
horsefly
We are not slaves of christ but sons of the king
The poisonness kind. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Horse fly
Horse fly
Horsefly
Cow killer ants
A wasp sting on your behind.
fire ants...they sting and itch and swell. jerks
Scorpion... Trust me it was really bad. Like hospital bad!!!
Red hornet
Wasp/hornet
An ant bite to the toe...the day before my wedding!
A lady bug bite...ugh
Fireant
Horsefly
Hornet
Caterpillar
Ground Bee
Fire ants
Brown recluse spider
Hornet
Red ants
That wasn't intresting that was boring
Sorry mean 1710
Mennonites were some of the first settlers of new bern in 17101 interesting!
Because people were too indolent to do things themselves. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Yours is working i see it
Why was slavery permitted in jesus time
Are Christians to think of themselves as slaves to Christ?
How do i know if mine is or isn't doing this?
Why is mine not up there
Yes it would be
Wouldn't it be funny if someone jumped out of the booth??
A walk 2 remember
Not working still.
Does goat milk spoil faster than cow milk? ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Roots
Reedeming love by francine rivers
To Kill A Mockingbird
The Shack by William Young
Nicolas sparks is a good author. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Star Wars!
The Lion, Witch , & the Wardrobe ΓΌ Chronicles of Narnia
LOTR is not an American work
all harry potter books
My sisters keeper
really? lol
The Outsiders
The stand
Turn Up The Heat
I love that movie.
Message in a bottle
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
Lord of the Rings
The sisterhood of the traveling pants
The cat in the hat
Breaking Dawn :Stephanie Meyer
lords of Dicsipline
The hardy boys
Nicolas sparks is a good author. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
The Notebook
Marry poppins
Old Man and the Sea
Frankenstein
My favorite author is Frank Perretti
My favorite book is The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks. £@UR¤N
Reedeming love by francine rivers
TWILIGHT! By: Stephanie Meyer
tom sawyer
The Pact by Jodi Picoult
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know if this is American. Ha!
A walk 2 remember
The stand
The Godfather
Where the red fern grows
was Back to the Future based on a novel?
Frank Perretti
Twilight. ((VNS&DNE)<3)
Of mice and men
Just trying it out
This is super cool :) ((VNS&DNE)<3)
can you hear me now...
I don't read
how do i know if mine is working or not?
Of all sermons to be serious this is THE one. Stop the text joking.
bullants
Is The confederate flad offensive? £@UR¤N
All ants.
a wasp sting on your booty.
Is flying the confederate flag offensive to others? £@UR¤N
A 20 ft tall yellow jacket
a wasp sting on your booty.
ants
jellyfish sting.
fire ants!
I HATE it when bed bugs bite!!!
spidermokey
Chores are slavery! £@UR¤N
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know If this is American? Ha!
this is pretty cool. hey everyone!
this is pretty cool. hey everyone!
Does prostitution count as slavery? £@UR¤N
mine isnt working
Riding Lessons £@UR¤N
why is william sanders so old?
The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks £@UR¤N
harry potter
The Scarlet letter £@UR¤N
To kill a mocking bird- I don't know If this is American. Ha!
Wait yes it did
plus your comments
Why is this not working?
harry potter books
My phones not doing this.
of mice and men is my favorite book i haven't read it though
i don't understand how to do this
my favorite book is of mice and men i haven't read it though
Marley and Me
The Pact by Jodi Picoult....anything by her is great!
i think jrr tolkien was british. i thought he said american writers.
to kill a mocking bird- I don't know I'd this is American. Ha!
Of mice and men is my favorite book i haven't read it though
The Guardian by Nicholas Sparks £@UR¤N
a child called it. £@UR¤N
I don't read
i don't read
Gone with the wind
the appeal
HARRY POTTER!!!
White Fang
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